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Topic Options
#989875 - 01/03/16 06:43 PM 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit
83USN88 Offline
J.O.A.T.

Registered: 06/19/11
Posts: 66
Loc: Hopewell
City or County: Hopewell
Since our governor and AG have betrayed the citizens of Virginia and begun their attempt at implementing Michael Bloombingidiotburg's agenda, how can we take the step like Maine just did and get the need for a concealed carry permit removed? Seems like the way to go to me.

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#990018 - 01/04/16 03:16 AM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: 83USN88]
TCV Offline
Pea shooter

Registered: 12/20/15
Posts: 7
Loc: Virginia
City or County: Petersburg/Fairfax
It's about time that Virginia should finally implement Consitutional carry. It's absurd to believe that open carry is permissible sans any form of permitting, yet the moment a jacket covers your sidearm you should suddenly require a background check, classes, and permission from the government. In fact, I believe open carry to be ideal for rural areas and smaller towns, while concealed carry is ideal for more urbanized higher population centers. I'm not against either form of carry to be perfectly honest, but Virginians should be allowed to make the choice for themselves.

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#996227 - 01/20/16 03:48 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: 83USN88]
Agent19 Offline
2A 4 All

Registered: 01/12/09
Posts: 2979
Loc: Greene
City or County: 22973
Constitutional carry needs your support:
http://www.campaignforliberty.org/petiti...7144b000c0567ba
_________________________
A "CHP" slip should be thought of as an embarrassment, an infringement to a free person."
~ Alan Korwin

If you have extra legal requirements, I ain't your guy.

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#996556 - 01/21/16 01:23 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: 83USN88]
Agent19 Offline
2A 4 All

Registered: 01/12/09
Posts: 2979
Loc: Greene
City or County: 22973
_________________________
A "CHP" slip should be thought of as an embarrassment, an infringement to a free person."
~ Alan Korwin

If you have extra legal requirements, I ain't your guy.

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#996641 - 01/21/16 06:10 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: Agent19]
Mark S Offline
General Nuisance

Registered: 04/29/10
Posts: 3516
Loc: Fairfax county
City or County: Fairfax
Originally Posted By: Agent19


I'd read it but it wants money from me and the last hing I'll do is support another lefty propaganda tool.

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#996702 - 01/21/16 08:57 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: Mark S]
Agent19 Offline
2A 4 All

Registered: 01/12/09
Posts: 2979
Loc: Greene
City or County: 22973
Originally Posted By: Mark S
Originally Posted By: Agent19


I'd read it but it wants money from me and the last hing I'll do is support another lefty propaganda tool.


I think you are CONFUSED.
The Wapo news story asking for $$$????
Now the campaign for liberty link might but signing the petition doesn't require a donation.
_________________________
A "CHP" slip should be thought of as an embarrassment, an infringement to a free person."
~ Alan Korwin

If you have extra legal requirements, I ain't your guy.

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#996829 - 01/22/16 09:52 AM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: Agent19]
Mark S Offline
General Nuisance

Registered: 04/29/10
Posts: 3516
Loc: Fairfax county
City or County: Fairfax
Originally Posted By: Agent19


I'd read it but it wants money from me and the last hing I'll do is support another lefty propaganda tool.


I think you are CONFUSED.
The Wapo news story asking for $$$????
Now the campaign for liberty link might but signing the petition doesn't require a donation.


It says that reached my 'free' number of articles for the month at WP and must pay to read more.

I signed the petition.


Edited by Mark S (01/22/16 09:52 AM)

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#996910 - 01/22/16 01:37 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: Mark S]
Agent19 Offline
2A 4 All

Registered: 01/12/09
Posts: 2979
Loc: Greene
City or County: 22973
Originally Posted By: Mark S


It says that reached my 'free' number of articles for the month at WP and must pay to read more.

I signed the petition.


Okay, that makes sense. smile

BOT:
Constitutional Carry bill cleared Senate committee Wednesday and is headed to the Senate Floor.
_________________________
A "CHP" slip should be thought of as an embarrassment, an infringement to a free person."
~ Alan Korwin

If you have extra legal requirements, I ain't your guy.

Top
#999066 - 01/28/16 02:09 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: Agent19]
jr45 Offline
Addicted

Registered: 11/30/08
Posts: 675
Loc: VA
City or County: Stafford
Looks like the Gov will reverse the ruling in exchange for concessions.

WP Article

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#999087 - 01/28/16 03:35 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: jr45]
v8unleashed Offline
Sharp Shooter

Registered: 04/04/09
Posts: 2417
Loc: nova
City or County: nova
Originally Posted By: jr45
Looks like the Gov will reverse the ruling in exchange for concessions.

WP Article


Just like the Republicans, trade one defeat for another, and call it a victory.

APPARENTLY VCDL IS BEHIND THESE COMPROMISES.

VOLUNTARY BACKGROUND CHECKS FOR PRIVATE SALES MIGHT SOUND FINE TO SOME. BUT WITHOUT A DOUBT, THE VERY NEXT STEP WILL BE TO MAKE BACKGROUND CHECKS MANDATORY FOR ALL PRIVATE SALES, AS SOON AS VCDL DOESN'T HAVE THE POLITICAL CLOUT TO STOP IT. ALL IN EXCHANGE FOR RECIPROCITY THIS YEAR.

VCDL IS UNWITTINGLY SELLING GUN OWNERS DOWN THE RIVER ON THIS ONE, BY TRYING TO NEGOTIATE WITH A TERRORIST.

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#999150 - 01/28/16 06:36 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: v8unleashed]
Mark S Offline
General Nuisance

Registered: 04/29/10
Posts: 3516
Loc: Fairfax county
City or County: Fairfax
Originally Posted By: v8unleashed
Originally Posted By: jr45
Looks like the Gov will reverse the ruling in exchange for concessions.

WP Article


Just like the Republicans, trade one defeat for another, and call it a victory.

APPARENTLY VCDL IS BEHIND THESE COMPROMISES.

VOLUNTARY BACKGROUND CHECKS FOR PRIVATE SALES MIGHT SOUND FINE TO SOME. BUT WITHOUT A DOUBT, THE VERY NEXT STEP WILL BE TO MAKE BACKGROUND CHECKS MANDATORY FOR ALL PRIVATE SALES, AS SOON AS VCDL DOESN'T HAVE THE POLITICAL CLOUT TO STOP IT. ALL IN EXCHANGE FOR RECIPROCITY THIS YEAR.

VCDL IS UNWITTINGLY SELLING GUN OWNERS DOWN THE RIVER ON THIS ONE, BY TRYING TO NEGOTIATE WITH A TERRORIST.


V8,

As I understand it:

- If someone’s Virginia permit is revoked, they can’t use another state’s permit to continue to carry in Virginia.

- State Police will be made available at gun shows to run background checks.

- Anyone subject to a permanent protective order (PPO) is barred from carrying for two years the order remains in effect. By federal law someone with a PPO can’t have a gun.

I do see your point that at anytime McAwful & his posse could tack on a 'rule' or some other maneuver that would inconvenience gun owners/carriers. But, I think that a move to 'require' background checks would take legislation and in that case, if we have a Dem Executive and Legislature, VCDL or any other group is already too late to stop it. Am I wrong on that or do you see another way they can sneak it in?

From a compromise perspective, if there isn't a way to get around the legislature and require background checks, I think this is potentially a BIG win. It takes the stupid 'gun show loophole' argument off the table, allows regular citizens the opportunity to do a background check on a buyer at a gun show if they so desire, and it keeps reciprocity in tact.

Am I being naive on this one?

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#999200 - 01/28/16 08:26 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: Mark S]
Agent19 Offline
2A 4 All

Registered: 01/12/09
Posts: 2979
Loc: Greene
City or County: 22973
Originally Posted By: Mark S

Am I being naive on this one?


Our elected officials have allowed the camels nose under the tent.
They should have waited McDouche out of office. Instead both sides can now claim victory, at freedoms expense.

The mere fact McDouche and Red are now willing to accept the same chp holders they claimed weren't qualified to carry under VA law shows the issues was truly a non starter.


I'll bet McAwful and Red will be looking for the next chink in the gun laws in VA for another round of concessions..
I suspect the voluntary gun show private sales background check will be changed to mandatory.


Chippers can Rejoice in their hollow victory


OCDO thread
_________________________
A "CHP" slip should be thought of as an embarrassment, an infringement to a free person."
~ Alan Korwin

If you have extra legal requirements, I ain't your guy.

Top
#999251 - 01/28/16 10:34 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: Agent19]
Mark S Offline
General Nuisance

Registered: 04/29/10
Posts: 3516
Loc: Fairfax county
City or County: Fairfax
Originally Posted By: Agent19
Originally Posted By: Mark S

Am I being naive on this one?


Our elected officials have allowed the camels nose under the tent.
They should have waited McDouche out of office. Instead both sides can now claim victory, at freedoms expense.

The mere fact McDouche and Red are now willing to accept the same chp holders they claimed weren't qualified to carry under VA law shows the issues was truly a non starter.


I'll bet McAwful and Red will be looking for the next chink in the gun laws in VA for another round of concessions..
I suspect the voluntary gun show private sales background check will be changed to mandatory.


Chippers can Rejoice in their hollow victory


OCDO thread


So wait 4-5 years to fix the CHP issue instead of giving up what exactly?

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#999385 - 01/29/16 12:31 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: 83USN88]
v8unleashed Offline
Sharp Shooter

Registered: 04/04/09
Posts: 2417
Loc: nova
City or County: nova
MORE NEWS:

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/2...olders-n2111474

Apparently the Republicans had VETO PROOF MAJORITIES in both houses to enact "TOTAL RECOGNITION" reciprocity legislation.

How exactly did that get turned into giving McAuliffe CONCESSIONS and letting him put back the STATUS QUO???

WHAT THE ___ IS GOING ON???

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#999387 - 01/29/16 12:33 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: v8unleashed]
Agent19 Offline
2A 4 All

Registered: 01/12/09
Posts: 2979
Loc: Greene
City or County: 22973
Originally Posted By: v8unleashed
MORE NEWS:

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/2...olders-n2111474

Apparently the Republicans had VETO PROOF MAJORITIES in both houses to enact "TOTAL RECOGNITION" reciprocity legislation.

How exactly did that get turned into giving McAuliffe CONCESSIONS and letting him put back the STATUS QUO???

WHAT THE ___ IS GOING ON???


http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/showthread.php?132239-The-Reciprocity-Restoration-Deal
_________________________
A "CHP" slip should be thought of as an embarrassment, an infringement to a free person."
~ Alan Korwin

If you have extra legal requirements, I ain't your guy.

Top
#999486 - 01/29/16 05:18 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: Agent19]
Cash is King Offline
Nice guy.

Registered: 09/15/11
Posts: 4578
Loc: Woodbridge/Stafford/Gloucester...
City or County: Prince William, Stafford & Gloucester monthly.
Originally Posted By: Agent19
Our elected officials have allowed the camels nose under the tent.


Exactly


Edited by Cash is King (01/29/16 05:19 PM)
_________________________
Be verdant... NOT petulant... in all things.

I-95 "Fast Lanes" solved NOTHING!!!


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#999497 - 01/29/16 05:47 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: v8unleashed]
Mark S Offline
General Nuisance

Registered: 04/29/10
Posts: 3516
Loc: Fairfax county
City or County: Fairfax
Originally Posted By: v8unleashed
MORE NEWS:

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/2...olders-n2111474

Apparently the Republicans had VETO PROOF MAJORITIES in both houses to enact "TOTAL RECOGNITION" reciprocity legislation.

How exactly did that get turned into giving McAuliffe CONCESSIONS and letting him put back the STATUS QUO???

WHAT THE ___ IS GOING ON???


Come on, V8, do you think those 3 Dems in the article would have voted to override the veto? It's a lot more likely that they voted that way knowing that a compromise would be struck or to help get a deal without ever having to be put in that position.

I've always seen the State Police at gun shows, now I can ask them to run a NICS check on someone I might want to sell a gun to. BUT, I don't have to. I see no way of changing that without legislation.

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#999643 - 01/30/16 06:37 AM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: 83USN88]
VaGunTrader Offline
The Dictator

Registered: 11/19/08
Posts: 3586
Loc: Dinwiddie County Va
City or County: Sutherland - 23885
So Herring and McAuliffe yank our reciprocity with other states, and then give it back in exchange for something else they want. I'm not a very smart guy but are we getting outsmarted?

The police at the gunshows doing volunteer background checks, thats been happening.
Turning over your guns if you are subject to a permanent protective order for a domestic violence offence....thats new.

Have we had any problems with out-of-stater-CHP holders shooting anyone in Virginia?

I hear the ANTIS crying foul, but didnt they get a little something?
_________________________
When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.
Thomas Jefferson

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#999678 - 01/30/16 08:33 AM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: VaGunTrader]
Cash is King Offline
Nice guy.

Registered: 09/15/11
Posts: 4578
Loc: Woodbridge/Stafford/Gloucester...
City or County: Prince William, Stafford & Gloucester monthly.
Originally Posted By: VaGunTrader
So Herring and McAuliffe yank our reciprocity with other states, and then give it back in exchange for something else they want.


To put it a different way...

Next... Herring and McAuliffe yank our 1st Amendment RIGHT to Free Speech... then decided to give it back to us in exchange for something else they want... higher taxes, banning diesel trucks, forced housing of 8,000,000 new immigrants to Virginia.

Even Frank Nitti would be impressed.



Edited by Cash is King (01/30/16 08:36 AM)
Edit Reason: typo
_________________________
Be verdant... NOT petulant... in all things.

I-95 "Fast Lanes" solved NOTHING!!!


Top
#1000148 - 01/31/16 09:21 AM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: 83USN88]
Cash is King Offline
Nice guy.

Registered: 09/15/11
Posts: 4578
Loc: Woodbridge/Stafford/Gloucester...
City or County: Prince William, Stafford & Gloucester monthly.
IMO...

Herring and McAuliffe deliberately pushed whatever anti gun agenda they thought was "doable" (yank reciprocity with other states)... and found out the backlash was far worse than any of their pollsters had ever thought... and this is a "fix" to help their party during a huge political year.

To my way of thinking it was in perfect tandem with Obama's EOs.

All is a steady squeeze for power and seeing which RIGHTS folks care most about keeping... and which they don't.


Edited by Cash is King (01/31/16 09:23 AM)
_________________________
Be verdant... NOT petulant... in all things.

I-95 "Fast Lanes" solved NOTHING!!!


Top
#1001688 - 02/04/16 07:01 AM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: 83USN88]
Mark S Offline
General Nuisance

Registered: 04/29/10
Posts: 3516
Loc: Fairfax county
City or County: Fairfax
After trading PMs with a number of people and talking with others, I have a better understanding of the problems with this compromise and no longer support it.

The 'voluntary' background check problem that could be made involuntary, used as a tool to enforce 'dealer' status, create a permanent record, put the VSP in the position to 'take action' against someone who failed the check, etc. are very troubling, especially given the inability of individuals to 'fix' the NICS record and the continuous additions Obama has been making through executive actions.

Nobody wants to be in the position of defending wife beaters, but this compromise also goes too far given the way that restraining orders are used today, the difference between state and federal law (service, process, etc) and 'construction possession' putting any gun holder in relation or on the premises of a restricted person at risk.

So to answer my own question, 'yes, I was being naive'. I no longer support the compromise. But, I also have possibly the most left wing Sen (Favola) and a useless Rep who votes along with her, so I'll need to know how else we can stop it and defeat McAuliffe and Herring's gun grab.

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#1001746 - 02/04/16 09:40 AM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: Mark S]
Cash is King Offline
Nice guy.

Registered: 09/15/11
Posts: 4578
Loc: Woodbridge/Stafford/Gloucester...
City or County: Prince William, Stafford & Gloucester monthly.
Originally Posted By: Mark S
... how else we can stop it and defeat McAuliffe and Herring's gun grab.


Consistent unified resolve to dismantle arcane laws, EOs and snares/traps set in place by insidious bureaucrats, professional politicians and their elite 1% sponsors.

Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness ARE self-evident RIGHTs.
_________________________
Be verdant... NOT petulant... in all things.

I-95 "Fast Lanes" solved NOTHING!!!


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#1002698 - 02/06/16 04:54 PM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: 83USN88]
Agent19 Offline
2A 4 All

Registered: 01/12/09
Posts: 2979
Loc: Greene
City or County: 22973
Gov. McAuliffe's EO caused the loss of gun carry of any sort into state agency buildings and workplace facilities, This is/should be of much greater importance than the loss of reciprocity for CHP holders. As Open carry is perfectly legal and well accepted in Virginia and doesn't require a permit.

Virginia still offers non-resident CHP's for visitors who wish.
There are other options for Out of Staters who wish to conceal in Virginia and for Virginian's traveling. FL/UT offer non res permits.

However, because of the Gov's EO there is NO option for carry in state agency buildings and workplaces.

EO50 and its resulting regulation nullifies all carry in our own facilities that we Virginia tax payers fund and use as part of our daily lives.


Imho, there should be more focus on the issues that actually affect Virginian's.



**********************************************************
Unintended consequences? McAuliffe’s gun ban stops some 4-H firearm-safety training
**********************************************************
https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/727/2016/02/sort/time_rev/page/1/entry/3:4/20160201235359:F69CF03A-C968-11E5-8467-74B1EF10038B/



From VCDL Alert 2-1-2016
I received this email from member Baxter Stegall:

I wanted to address a major issue that’s just been brought to my attention. I have spoken with a source who wishes not to be named due to fear of reprisal, who is heavily involved in the 4H programs in Virginia. The 4H program in 19 counties in Central Virginia utilize the Holiday Lake 4H Center at Holiday Lake State Park in Appomattox, VA. The 4H facility leases the land from the Virginia Department of Forestry, an executive agency.

Last week, people came and posted No Guns signs around the 4H camp. As you well know, 4H is one of the biggest proponents of firearms safety for children, and the Holiday Lake facility hosts summer camps for childrens’ firearms sports, as well as tournaments and training throughout the year in support of the 4H firearms programs. These programs have effectively been shut down by the fallout from Governor McAulliffe’s Executive Order.



Please contact your elected officials.




_________________________
A "CHP" slip should be thought of as an embarrassment, an infringement to a free person."
~ Alan Korwin

If you have extra legal requirements, I ain't your guy.

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#1002902 - 02/07/16 08:17 AM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: Agent19]
Cash is King Offline
Nice guy.

Registered: 09/15/11
Posts: 4578
Loc: Woodbridge/Stafford/Gloucester...
City or County: Prince William, Stafford & Gloucester monthly.
Originally Posted By: Agent19
Gov. McAuliffe's EO caused the loss of gun carry of any sort into state agency buildings and workplace facilities, This is/should be of much greater importance than the loss of reciprocity for CHP holders.


SPOT ON!

Two steps back... one step sideways and 51%+ of gun owners are happy with what they were "GIVEN" back... and go la-la-la and move on.

It is FORMULA that the anti-gun folks use all the time and very effectively against me/us.
_________________________
Be verdant... NOT petulant... in all things.

I-95 "Fast Lanes" solved NOTHING!!!


Top
#1004594 - 02/11/16 08:09 AM Re: 2nd Amendment as Concealed Carry Permit [Re: 83USN88]
v8unleashed Offline
Sharp Shooter

Registered: 04/04/09
Posts: 2417
Loc: nova
City or County: nova
The VCDL-NRA-McAwful "deal" bills passed the house yesterday, 96-3. Including yea votes by a few delegates who had personal contact with me about why this is a terrible idea. With "friends" like these....

GOA, the only pro gun group to come out against this, did an analysis of how we could get screwed by this, which is available here:
https://www.gunowners.org/state02022016.htm

To say the least, it will be interesting to see how this shakes out.

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